Sitat fra: Elmo på onsdag 01. november 2017, klokken 12:34
I have to change some batteries first.

Winter is coming, it's battery replacement time ! (I also did some replacements last weekend )

Sitat fra: timescape på mandag 30. oktober 2017, klokken 19:11
So can scale divide  0->150A.  ?

I always try to optimize the display on screen. The 150A was delivered by the PSA charge stations that do not exist anymore. I don't know people charging at 150A nowadays. I know that some people charge at 60A (Elmo) and read about some people charging at 80A. So I think it's not worth extending to 150A because for most of the people charging at 14A it will be difficult to see the difference between charge and overcharge (the difference will be just some pixels). So 2 solutions I can extend to a lower value (60, 80 ?). My favourite solution would be to be able to get the information from ECU if it is a fast or normal charge and then scale according to this info. I have not studied this case yet.

Sitat fra: timescape på onsdag 01. november 2017, klokken 13:34
could scaling coefficient be 1,5 ?

1,5 is too much. Look at Elmo's values and try to find the best ratio between Checkelec and Lexia colum. 1,4 is not enough. 1,46 or 1,47 is good (we need more measurements to be more precise). 1,5 is too much : 29*1,5=43,5 vs 42 on Lexia.
As we are trying to scale an ECU data, it's important to take for reference a software reading the ECU data (Lexia, PP2000) and not another data source (Amp clamp, solenoid) as we don't know the error on this source. However, the external sources are useful to confirm the Lexia data (there could be a bug !)

Thanks,
So it looks that the right scaling coefficient to apply is more something like 1.46 (rather than 1.41).
Btw, I observe also a charge at 14A and I'm very surprised to have an overcharge at 7A. I believed it was 5A according to the PSA docs and SAFT specs. Do you noticed the same ?

On the road again ! I changed 3 battery blocks this weekend !

Sitat fra: timescape på søndag 29. oktober 2017, klokken 23:25
The document can be found in a zip file linked to from . In the "Dansk" folder. (I looked it is not in the French language folder. But maybe you can find it on the French forum..).

Thanks for the link  . I had never seen this interesting document and I'm sure that we don't have an equivalent on the French forum (Although some equivalent chapters can be found in other documents).

Sitat fra: timescape på søndag 29. oktober 2017, klokken 23:25
When starting charge from empty batteries, the charger is in "constant Power" charging.

I'm not Danish fluent : on page 147, they talk about "konstant effekt" -> does that mean "constant power" ? Google translates this by "constant effect".

Sitat fra: timescape på søndag 29. oktober 2017, klokken 23:25
Please see picture from SAFT datasheet. Current or power charging difference.. In Power charging upto 140W module is allowed.

When I look at the SAFT documentation I read in §5.2.4 (page 18) that the MRE batteries shall be charged at constant current (20A).
In that SAFT document (where your table comes from), they talk about the possibility to charge at constant power or constant current.

I found in a commercial PSA document page 49/51 that the charge are supposed to be performed at constant current. But that document is a tech-commercial one so maybe not technically accurate.

In that Saxo technical document on page 23(15), they show charge graphs with varying current without more information.

Finally, what is sure is that the ECU shows a constant current value during charging in the transmitted data. As this data is the same as the one used to represent current drawn out of the battery during driving, I supposed it was also representing the current pulled in the battery during charging. But maybe it is the current drawn from main during charging ?

So the charging method used by PSA and the meaning of the current value read in the data messages are still not clear for me .

Sitat fra: timescape på søndag 29. oktober 2017, klokken 10:50
It looks like you are showing the ac mains current. I measured 14Aac from mains and the app. showed 14ADC current..
[...]
Is it RDD byte 5 you are looking at ?

Yes, I'm using this byte, that's why I said that's the ECU current data. So the problem is actually to determine the scaling factor to apply to this byte data to have the real value. But whatever this scaling factor is, this value remains constant so that's why I was talking about a CC charge (Constant current).

I'm not a battery expert, but I know that most of the battery technologies (Nicd, Nimh, Lipo, etc.) are charged using a CC/CV method (Constant current phase followed by a constant voltage phase). The PSA Nicd seem to be charged using a CC/CC method (according to SAFT docs).

Regarding the display, I think that the scaling factor is around 1.41 which is roughly the square root of 2, the ratio between peak and RMS current (i.e. between AC and DC). I don't know if this is just random or if there is a reason for that but in every case, the value I consider is representing the battery current measured by the ECU and not the main current.

By the way, where does the table of your second picture comes from ? I would be very interested to get the source document. No problem if it is in Danish, Google will help me !

Sitat fra: timescape på søndag 29. oktober 2017, klokken 10:50
Yes, I do run the car in yellow/RED on econometer often. The City I live in have hils around it and people gets "pissed" if I am too slow

Don't you have problems with your motor brushes and/or copper collector ?
For my part, I have also a big hill (10% capacity used on way and 10% on return just for that hill). And as I have every day nearly 60km with 40km at nearly 100A for 90km/h, I try to not go above 100A despite the car flashes from others !

Sitat fra: Elmo på torsdag 26. oktober 2017, klokken 11:29
Tested on one of my cars.  Charging set to 10A AC.   Checkelec shows 6A.  Clamp-metee shows 9,2A

Sitat fra: timescape på torsdag 26. oktober 2017, klokken 13:36
14Aac on the mains.
18,3ADC with current clamp on battery wire..

So in Elmo case we have a DC nearly equal to AC current, and in Timescape case we have a DC current higher than AC. Strange... 
It could be good to have the Lexia (or equivalent) value also with these measurements if possible.
You have also different high and low voltage software versions (Timescape V3.50 vs Elmo V3.3C). It could be possible that the scaling is different following those versions.

Sitat fra: timescape på torsdag 26. oktober 2017, klokken 13:36
Please note that the Battery current will change during charge.. It depends on the Battery voltage !

I don't think that the charge is performed at constant power, but rather at constant current. It's at least what is indicated by the ECU (whatever the scaling coefficient, the returned current value is constant during the charge).
So I think that the power drawn from main will increase during charge (assuming that the charger thermal losses are constant).

Sitat fra: timescape på torsdag 26. oktober 2017, klokken 13:36
Same during driving SAXO can pul 200A from the battery. But graf only goes to 150A... 

Yes I know, but as 200A is in the red econometer part, I voluntarily stopped the graph at 150A (orange/red limit) to have a better resolution in the normal operation range. I suppose you rarely go above 150A ? Personally, I rarely go above 100A.
I's the same in the negative part : the graph is limited at -100A. If you make a very big regen braking you can go below but as it is rare it's not worth reducing the graph resolution for that.

Sitat fra: Elmo på torsdag 26. oktober 2017, klokken 11:29
Tested on one of my cars.  Charging set to 10A AC.   Checkelec shows 6A.  Clamp-metee shows 9,2A

Saxo or 106 ? They are supposed to be the same but on my 106 set on 10A AC, Checkelec shows 10A during charge and then 5A during overcharge. What does Checkelec show on yours during overcharge phase ?
Did you measure the 9.2A on one of the cables connected to the battery fuse or on the charging cable ?
I have a clamp amp meter but never measured. I will do this next week, my car being actually under maintenance : two battery blocks to change !

Sitat fra: timescape på onsdag 25. oktober 2017, klokken 20:56
DC charge current was displayed to 16A..
But I should be charging with arox. 22ADC (14Aac)..

Yes, there may be an error in the scaling factor of the current. I haven't made measurements yet, so if somebody can provide current measurement (with an amp clamp) with associated displayed value on the app, this would help a lot to set the right scaling factor.

Sitat fra: timescape på tirsdag 24. oktober 2017, klokken 14:47
Any news on the app. ?

The V2.0 is not far from being released but still under final debugging !

Sitat fra: timescape på tirsdag 24. oktober 2017, klokken 14:47
Is there a place where I can follow the development ?

I may setup a website in the future to give information, collect requests, etc. but have no time for that actually

Sitat fra: timescape på onsdag 11. oktober 2017, klokken 22:48
About water service..
I normally do not wait for the lamp..
I set in maint. charge and wait for lamp. Then reset need for water.. (and set charge mode normal).
So I guess i will be great if the water service could be triggered manually in the app. (or it was possible to reset need for water.

You can already trigger the maintenance charge by clicking on the maintenance button in the "charge" page of the app.
However, the current version will not allow you to clear the water need (and lamp) at the end of the water refill.
In the next version that will be possible. And that function will appear only when the lamp will be lit on the car dashboard.

Well, actually I programmed the app so that the water reset page appears only when the water light is on. There may be a problem on that point (the page may not appear as expected!).
So I would like to test the complete cycle (launch maintenance charge, do the refill and try to clear the need and light with the app). My car won't require a maintenance charge before the end of the year, so that's why I'm looking for a beta tester .

Sitat fra: Elmo på onsdag 11. oktober 2017, klokken 14:15
I dont understand why tis is interesting/necessary    Both Lexia and PP2000 works on both Citroen and Peugeot, and also on non-electric cars.

It's absolutely unnecessary nor interesting as soon as you are able to launch Lexia or pp2000 directly ! 
I think that diagbox was created by PSA for professionals so that they don't need to know which software to launch depending on the car they work on. There are also additionnal functions like link with on line support or data but you need a professional account.
Eventually, it's also a very heavy software for an old xp pc. Very long to install (several hours, really !) and also very performance consuming (your pc need a good cpu fan !).

Sitat fra: Elmo på onsdag 11. oktober 2017, klokken 10:40
BUT, when I took up the phone to do it, the screen flipped (vertical to horisontal) and all the logging was gone

Is that something you can fix Steens ??

I know, it happened to me recently also ! I definitely need to correct this. However, for the coming version I worked on fault codes reading/clearing and water need clearing (and bug correction). I will then work on data logging for the following version.

By the way, I'm looking for a beta tester to test the water need clearing function. So, if someone plan a maintenance charge with water refill in the very next days, I can provide a beta version. Let me know.

Sitat fra: Niram1969 . på onsdag 11. oktober 2017, klokken 09:02
Voltage values are not correct. It seems that they are off by 26%. I will collect more data and give you exact value.

Hi Marin,
Thanks for your feedback. I already noticed this problem. It is confirmed by your screenshots : your ECU has an Autodiag version 31 while the most common version is 32 (And the app was developped for v32). In Autodiag v31, there is a different scaling coefficient for voltage. The next Checkelec version will take the Autodiag version into account. I have estimated the coefficient for v31 but I still need a more precise value. Do you have the Lexia software ?

Sitat fra: Elmo på søndag 08. oktober 2017, klokken 10:57
I have seen the Diagbox program om my disks, but I never understood that this is actually an alternative to Lexia/Proxia/PP2000 that I have all tried.

Diagbox is just a PSA user interface working for all PSA vehicles (not only electric ones) and that launches the right program depending on your vehicle selection. So if you select "Saxo", it will launch Lexia and if you select "106", it will launch PP2000.

Sitat fra: Elmo på onsdag 04. oktober 2017, klokken 10:24
But as you can see I did not see any curve at all, even if the charging + driving lasted for over an hour

Both graphs were after 1 hour ? Do you mean the app was connected (not in background) during one hour, or you entered in the monitoring page after one hour ? We can see on the second that there is at least two points.

On the first graph, the current is out of scale so it's not surprising that there is no current curve but we should see the voltage curve

When you start a charge, the app replaces the pages "charge" and "monitoring" by a special page to monitor the charge. It looks like the "monitoring" page but with the following differences :

• The type of charge is indicated
• The time scale is different (1 hour per division)
• The current scale is adapted to the charge (but maybe not to fast chargers )
• The voltage scale is also higher than in driving mode
• The current sign is inverted so it is positive when charging (but I know, current sign is a big topic )
• The sampling is only one point per minute

When you stop the charge, the "charge monitoring" page remains so you can look at the curve. Once you come back to the menu, you will retrieve the normal pages in "monitoring" and "charge".
So what you describe seems ok to me, just go back to the menu and return in "monitoring" page before driving. The only problem is when you charge with a current higher than 20A. I will think about it for a future evolution.

Sitat fra: Helge på tirsdag 03. oktober 2017, klokken 16:07
the watering cap (terskelverdi) says 870 Ah.

I would say that this is the normal value, whatever the charge rate you set. I think that the lower value of 450Ah is a kind of "degraded mode" where the ECU goes only after an internal bug requiring a parameter reset (or "load parameters"). It is generally associated with the fault "Parameters of the Control Unit".

Sitat fra: Helge på tirsdag 03. oktober 2017, klokken 16:07
I experienced Checkelec stopping yesterday. Had to close Checkelec with Advanced Task Killer to get it to connect again to the PRODIAG unit.

What kind of stopping ? App freeze ? Or PSA connection unrecoverable ? I changed many things in the next version so that there will be fewer disconnections and less app crash. Coming soon...